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Re: [tor-talk] Full integration with bitcoin (suggestion / feature request)



I did not read this thread completely but keep it in my TODO list.

Your analysis is correct but can be summarized in one sentence: using bt
over Tor is a non sense because the size of the Tor network is
completely ridiculous compared to the size of the bt network.

As ridiculous as using bt over a VPN, which the bt VPN trolls don't like
to hear.

Disabling the DHT and allowing trackers only is at the opposite of any
privacy protection, because trackers are trivial to monitor and fake,
it's a little bit more difficult with the DHT, but still easy for
someone that can crawl it.

I have tried to explain all this in the FAQs here:
http://torrent-live.org and here: https://github.com/Ayms/torrent-live,
and related study, which for once does not focus on trackers and
monitoring the users, but focuses on the DHT and monitoring/blocking the
monitors, showing also how easily you can protect using the DHT only,
assuming that your bt client is willing to (like torrent-live)...

Tor does not handle UDP but you can tunnel UDP through Tor to some SOCKS
proxies, which, again, is ridiculous but just works.

And, again, a possible solution is the Peersm project (which before
using the DHT does envision new means for peers/content discovery) or
something similar, a P2P using the Tor protocol, not the Tor network.

Le 30/04/2015 22:18, Speak Freely a écrit :
> Hi Akater,
> 
> Traffic overload is still an issue, yes. This causes problems for
> everyone. That was my #2, being mean. Sorry for not clarifying that.
> Good read:
> https://svn.torproject.org/svn/projects/roadmaps/2009-03-11-performance.pdf
> It's a few years old, but covers a lot and still relevant.
> 
> But the reason for not using BT over Tor is IMHO more than anything a
> security/anonymity issue.
> 
> Let's look at the reason why someone thinks they would want to use BT
> over Tor.
> - They believe it will provide them anonymity.
> 
> What benefit would Tor be to the user if their BT client of choice
> provided their actual IP address to the tracker and to each peer? The
> answer is mostly none. (There are certain circumstances where that's not
> completely true, for example ISPs that do DPI to throttle torrent traffic.)
> 
> Unless your ISP does DPI and throttles you, you will almost certainly
> always download slower, for several reasons I won't elucidate. This just
> gives interested parties more time to find you. If your ISP does do DPI,
> there are better ways around that. Tor is slow.
> 
> BT uses UDP and TCP. Tor doesn't do UDP, but it does TCP very well.
> There are ways to block the UDP, but most people would never think/know
> about that, and many users find that disabling UDP/DHT makes their peer
> count drop which makes them re-enable it immediately out of fear their
> download may take a little longer.
> 
> So, with a BT client that exposes your real IP address to the tracker
> and peers, and DHT through UDP being sent over clearnet, any concept of
> privacy/anonymity is broken.
> 
> Yes, you can disable DHT. You can block UDP connections. You could find
> a BT client that doesn't expose your real IP address. But then certain
> mis-steps and limitations within Tor also provide attack vectors for
> de-anonymizing torrent users.
> https://hal.inria.fr/file/index/docid/471556/filename/TorBT.pdf
> 
> 
> ... The reasons I say this is because I know someone who used Tor to
> download torrents, and his ISP kindly let him know that HBO provided
> them detailed logs that he downloaded specific episodes of one of their
> most popular shows. He thought he was being very smart and protecting
> himself, and was dumbfounded when his ISP contacted him.
> 
> 
> Matt
> Speak Freely
> 

-- 
Check the 10 M passwords list: http://peersm.com/findmyass
Anti-spies and private torrents, dynamic blocklist: http://torrent-live.org
Peersm : http://www.peersm.com
torrent-live: https://github.com/Ayms/torrent-live
node-Tor : https://www.github.com/Ayms/node-Tor
GitHub : https://www.github.com/Ayms
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